Micros 2 Weeks Update

[Texgal]

dfollett
SeanInVa

Hey Guys, Please let me know if there is another section you prefer to have updates. I put one in the crosses section but then afterwards I saw what Sean put there, so it may not be appropriate there. It would be helpful to have some direction on where you want the updates on specific seeds we are growing. I am assuming my seeds are the multi-flora but I wasn't sure. Would appreciate some feedback on that.

I have 3 varieties that Dan sent and going to post this update here but please let me know if going forward you want updates in a separate topic for each variety?


These starts at the time of the photo were 2 weeks old. Planted in Pro-Mix BX. Just hit them with some very weak Miracle-Gro Liquid Feed a few days ago after I shot these and in just that time, they look much better than the pics below. I was impressed these broke the soil in 4 days! It was a nice day here in Texas so they spent a few hours out in the sunshine today.
Here is the initial set of pics:


88X F4-3-5
A couple of little seeds started off fine but at the time of this shot were struggling. They are better now after a little liquid feed, so perhaps they will turn out. 100% germination.




111X F2
These remind me of my great-nephew's bed hair. All over the place. ?



164X F2
One cell did not germinate. Nice looking true leaves.

[SeanInVa]

Thanks for the update! There are a couple ways you could do general updates. The Blogs feature here might be a good way to accomplish that. You can "tag" your posts and use the line names as the tags.

You can also post line-specific updates in the respective "Crosses" forums. The stuff I was posting there was general info on those lines to be stickied to the top of each for people to easily find info on them. The intention is for everyone to discuss the crosses and report some updates in each particular forum so we can keep some of that organized.

[dfollett]

dfollett
[USER="1"]SeanInVa[/USER


111X F2
These remind me of my great-nephew's bed hair. All over the place. ?

The 111X are the ones you need to really plant lots of and cull heavily. They are F2s of a cross between an unstable micro and a full size F1 indeterminate. They will literally be all over the place.

• 75% of the plants will be full-size and their papa - 7H22 - is a very large indeterminate plant, as large as any tomato plant you'll grow in your garden.
  • The full-size plants are immediately identifiable and can be culled even before they put out their first true leaves. I use a small pair of scissors and snip the tops off.
• 25% of the plants that will be a blend of dwarf and micro
  • Approximately 75% of that 25% (18.75% of all the plants) will be regular dwarf plants. They will eventually get 3-5 feet in height.
  • That leaves approximately 6.25% of the total planted that might be micro - 6 out of 100 that sprouted.
    • That is if the micro is controlled by a single gene. I am of the opinion that there are several genes that control being micro. If that is the case, there could be far fewer than 6% that eventually remain micro.
    • My experience has been that the percentage of plants that remain micro varies quite significantly between different crosses. I have not grown out 111X, so I can't give you any specific guidance other than it definitely will not be more than 6 of 100 that will be micro.
  • As they put out their first pair of true leaves, the dwarfs will also be identifiable. They will tower above the ones you are looking for. Keep culling the taller ones as they separate themselves.

I will attach a couple of photos of a flat of F2s I am currently growing. They are pairs of photos of the same flat from two different angles before and after I did a first culling. I have since gone back through and culled more - mainly because additional seeds sprouted. The first two photos show how many were culled. The second photos show the height differential from before and after the culling. You can see that as thick as these are planted the little one will quickly be starved for light. You can plant them differently, but the numbers of tall and tiny one will be about the same as these.

I will probably pot up an average of 2-3 plants per row of 12 from this flat (or 48-72 plants) and of those maybe grow 24 to fruiting.

Depending on what you are looking for, there is a bunch of other culling you may need to do. I don't have time to finish right now, but this will get you started.

[Texgal]

Thanks for this information Dan. Fyi, I have to be away for a few days, but will follow up with you next week.

[oakley]

I have two trays similar to what Dan posted above. Started feb 2. Out of aprox 60 seedlings, I just this morning culled 70%.
(129x-F2 79x-CaptLucky) . Next door tray, 148x-F2 I have not culled yet. They are all very micro in appearance at this time.

[dfollett]

Oakley - I may not have given you all the information I should have about what I sent you. 148X is a cross between two micro crosses - (88X F2) X (93X F3). The 88X mama was carrot leaf and 93X papa was regular leaf. The F2s from that cross should basically all be micro, although some micro X micro crosses have had F2s that showed unexpected differences in size - (some too tall). With those you will need to treat them like you do at the F3 and later stage for the other crosses you are working with. you will need to use whatever selection criteria you use besides height to cull. There should be about 75% regular leaf and 25% carrot leaf if you have a preference for one or the other. That could be an early selection criteria.

The 93X was one of those that set an initial batch of fruit at about 6" then as they were ripening, sent up a second 'main' stem and set another batch of fruit in a multiflora inflorescence at 13" or so. I didn't weigh the fruit on 93X, but they were quite large for the plant size.


Sean, feel free to move this post to a different thread if you think it is better somewhere else.

[oakley]

That was exactly my initial observation. From past experience. Nice to have the history. This would be a two seed per cell,
1010 tray, 36 cell tray. I planted dense so it was hard to tell if some were just late to germinate, or were shadowed by the leggy.
I culled to about 16. I'm planning another tray but just two per cell to better follow.

Grow room is always an issue once potting up.
Nice thing about 'hunting' F2 micros is a full 1010 tray is easily pared down to maybe 12, then 4-6. Not at all real-estate hogs.

Texgal. Just do what you can. It is a fun grow. One thing I did that first year, 2017?, I culled, grew out, only saved seed from the
best flavor and micro in height...12 inches...then started seed again in July august...culled to 4-6 plants, saved seed, grew in sept October and grew indoors. What I had room for. Started seed again around thanksgiving. Three grows a year.
I can winter grow 8-10 micros in small pots.

[bjbebs]

1st picture shows a tray started last week in February. 70x, 88x, 93x, 135x and 145x. Spotty germination for 70x, very poor for 88x, others good. Just planted 51x F6, 73x F6, 70x, 93x, 135x and 145x. 51x throws a good tasting 1 oz. yellow. 73x makes a slightly larger red on a fuzzy leaf plant. Both seem to be somewhat stable and are now at F6. Neither is highly productive but keep making fruit through the season. 51x acts like a determinate but keeps chugging along. The fuzzy leaf in picture 3 is 73x. Another note on this cross, even the fruit has a bit of peach fuzz on it.

Will probably grow 2 or 3 plants of each variety outdoors. The best tasting micro so far has been 51x but I expect some of Dan's new offerings will be better.

[dfollett]

How do you like the fuzzys? They look good and healthy. I should have sent you some carrot leaf fuzzy ones to round out your varieties. I enjoy growing them, but find the fuzzy fruit interesting but a little off-putting to eat.

[bjbebs]

It's like growing an ornamental pepper. All about the looks not the taste. I don't expect these will improve in taste. I won't be growing 45x this year which was the only carrot leaf so far. Plant was a bit too rangy. Your crosses are sure fun to grow.

[dfollett]

I've had a hard time keeping the 45X line stocky enough for micros. It like to grow skinny and taller than I want.